Auto to manual swap

[v8e36]

G'day

I have a factory automatic BMW from the early 90s which I intend to convert to manual

I have all 100% original BMW parts from a factory manual donor car that simply require bolting in to spec, there is no cutting or modified parts for this conversion so it would be identical to a factory manual swapped car once done.

Would this require a certification?

The guidelines are a bit vague on some deals

Thanks in advance.
Mike

[Chris]

Aug 18, 2022 13:16:09 GMT 12 v8e36 said:

G'day

I have a factory automatic BMW from the early 90s which I intend to convert to manual

I have all 100% original BMW parts from a factory manual donor car that simply require bolting in to spec, there is no cutting or modified parts for this conversion so it would be identical to a factory manual swapped car once done.

Would this require a certification?

The guidelines are a bit vague on some deals

Thanks in advance.
Mike

Hi Mike

Most of the time a swap from auto to manual will require replacement of the brake pedal system. This includes cutting down the original brake pedal pad or switching from an auto brake pedal to a manual brake pedal as they have a smaller brake pedal pad. This always requires certification.

The modification threshold document states that a gearbox swap does not require certification providing

▪ the OE gearbox cross-member has not been heated, cut or welded; and

▪ the OE gearbox cross-member mounting to the OE body or chassis members is unchanged; and

▪ no replacement gearbox cross-member is used; and

▪ the OE drive-shaft(s) remain and is un-modified; and

▪ no substantial modifications have occurred to the floor or gearbox tunnel area, other than provision for gear-shift mechanism; and

▪ the braking system is not modified or changed, including the brake pedal

Where the requirement mentions OE components, it means OE to the vehicle being modified, a manual version of the same vehicle is NOT considered OE to the vehicle being modified if they are different part numbers.

Cheers

Chris 

[v8e36]

So the only consideration is the auto to manual brake pedal.

Are there any cert requirements around changing from an OEM automatic driveshaft to a OEM manual driveshaft that bolts in place? (Driveshaft is not modified, straight from donor car)

[Chris]

Aug 18, 2022 22:34:41 GMT 12 v8e36 said:

So the only consideration is the auto to manual brake pedal.

Are there any cert requirements around changing from an OEM automatic driveshaft to a OEM manual driveshaft that bolts in place? (Driveshaft is not modified, straight from donor car)

Hi Mike

No driveshaft loop is required providing the driveshaft is not an aftermarket driveshaft, it has not been modified by welding and the vehicle has not had a significant increase in horsepower or torque (50% is considered significant) 

Cheers

Chris

[v8e36]

Aug 19, 2022 7:54:25 GMT 12 Chris said:

Aug 18, 2022 22:34:41 GMT 12 v8e36 said:

So the only consideration is the auto to manual brake pedal.

Are there any cert requirements around changing from an OEM automatic driveshaft to a OEM manual driveshaft that bolts in place? (Driveshaft is not modified, straight from donor car)

Hi Mike

No driveshaft loop is required providing the driveshaft is not an aftermarket driveshaft, it has not been modified by welding and the vehicle has not had a significant increase in horsepower or torque (50% is considered significant) 

Cheers

Chris

Thanks, I gathered this was the case.

So in theory if I did all the OEM change of parts to a manual conversion, but just left the wider automatic brake pedal then no certification wold be required?

[Chris]

Aug 19, 2022 13:12:08 GMT 12 v8e36 said:

Aug 19, 2022 7:54:25 GMT 12 Chris said:

Hi Mike

No driveshaft loop is required providing the driveshaft is not an aftermarket driveshaft, it has not been modified by welding and the vehicle has not had a significant increase in horsepower or torque (50% is considered significant) 

Cheers

Chris

Thanks, I gathered this was the case.

So in theory if I did all the OEM change of parts to a manual conversion, but just left the wider automatic brake pedal then no certification wold be required?

You used the word change, which sounds like you are using different parts to the original automatic parts. Which would probably push the modification over threshold.

A very finger in the air quick test would be as long as you are only fitting the manual gearbox, flywheel and clutch, (ie: using the automatic crossmember, automatic driveshaft, automatic brake pedal and automatic pedal box) and only performing minor floor modifications for clearance, it shouldn't require certification. But without knowing the specifics of what you are doing, I cannot possibly give a conclusive answer to this question.

[v8e36]

The manual gearbox swap would mean using a manual specific cross member and manual specific driveshaft - again these are just bolt in parts, not modified, cut or welded, transferred over from a stock manual car to an automatic car.

The crazy part of all this is I know at least half a dozen BMW and Toyota people with manual converted cars which have no certs for the swap and they get WOFs without an issue. All those cars would be using OEM brand parts in the conversions so they appear as a stock vehicle to the untrained eye.

Passing a WOF is one thing, but I'm only interested in making sure I don't run into insurance claim issues if the manual gearbox changes mean I need a certification. I'm sure an insurance company would gladly void your insurance if they picked up on such details that didn't match up.

[Chris]

Aug 19, 2022 14:17:12 GMT 12 v8e36 said:

The manual gearbox swap would mean using a manual specific cross member and manual specific driveshaft - again these are just bolt in parts, not modified, cut or welded, transferred over from a stock manual car to an automatic car.

The crazy part of all this is I know at least half a dozen BMW and Toyota people with manual converted cars which have no certs for the swap and they get WOFs without an issue. All those cars would be using OEM brand parts in the conversions so they appear as a stock vehicle to the untrained eye.

Passing a WOF is one thing, but I'm only interested in making sure I don't run into insurance claim issues if the manual gearbox changes mean I need a certification. I'm sure an insurance company would gladly void your insurance if they picked up on such details that didn't match up.

Yup I know people too, but avoidance of compliance is not compliance. It's the same as an unconsented extension on the house. Doesn't mean it is acceptable and we all know that if your insurance can find any way of declining a claim, they surely will.

Cheers

Chris